Steve Vai
Endurance Guy: Tolerates most of us.
I always say Engineers should have to actually work on the things they design, because it's very obvious that none of them do.
It's 2026 Is an Emtb in your near future?
- Thread starter mattybfat
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I always say Engineers should have to actually work on the things they design, because it's very obvious that none of them do.
Ian F
Well-Known Member
Well... interchangeable parts is one of the criteria I've built into my fleet of mtn bikes... it was one reason I chose the Heckler over other options I tried and one reason why I haven't felt much need to "upgrade" any of the fleet.
I've spent so much time on the construction side of my job that it has definitely affected how I design the systems for my projects. But WTF do I know... I'm just a journalist who works as an electrical engineer...
JDurk
Well-Known Member
The engineer in me says F-it. Just ride my bikes with 135 QR, 142 and 157 Pivot. Not a 148 bike to be found in my quiver.
JDurk
Well-Known Member
We have an "engineer" here that is the definition of this. His knickname is D.A.D. = dumbass Dan
Steve Vai
Endurance Guy: Tolerates most of us.
My cousin is a Civil Engineer that designed pretty much all of the bike paths in the tri-state. Every time I ride a bike lane I'm like WTF? You obviously have never ridden a bicycle ever. And she hasn't.
Ian F
Well-Known Member
And over here in Bucks County, PA...
A good percentage of the roads here don't even have an appreciable shoulder...
Steve Vai
Endurance Guy: Tolerates most of us.
We have ones that go and then just dump you onto a highway with no shoulder or some shit. The one on my street does that. I keep telling her to think about it when she's at my funeral.
tonyride
Don't piss off the red guy
That may be true since I've experienced this from fixing things around the house and working on my cars as well as bikes to some extent. I know plenty of engineers who don't know which end of the screw driver to hold. I'm not that kind. I have worked on cars where I just don't understand why they designed it the way they did but to say none of them actually work on the things they design is just not true. You only notice it when the design is poor but don't notice it when the design is good. Without engineers that thing you get to work on wouldn't even exist in the first place. OK, this post may be the end of me.
Fat Trout
Well-Known Member
Sometimes engineers are told/ forced to do things by the customer or non engineer mgmt. Ive often been told i have a "bad attitude"...no your requests are stupid lol.
That said. A while back i han engineer friend who had an engineer husband. Was asked to help with something at their house at lunch. ZERO tools in the house...wtf? Said ill be back tomorrow.
That said. A while back i han engineer friend who had an engineer husband. Was asked to help with something at their house at lunch. ZERO tools in the house...wtf? Said ill be back tomorrow.
Ian F
Well-Known Member
As far as working on cars, one thing I've learned over the years is to think about what the assembly process was intended to be. Modern cars are designed to be as fast/easy/cheap as possible to go together on an assembly line. Service after the fact is of secondary importance. Sometimes, reverse-engineering the assembly process can make working on a component a little easier to figure out.
tonyride
Don't piss off the red guy
I agree 100%. Engineers rarely get to approve the final design, often times it's the bean counters that make the final decision. Do you think Mercedes engineers designed to have so many plastic parts on their engines? Mercedes Benz got the reputation they had because it was run by engineers and everything was over engineered. Ever since the company was taken over by bean counters the quality has gone downhill. I'm sure this is true for many other car companies too. I'm using MB as an example only because I've owned one post corporate takeover and I've seen and experienced it first hand. You can learn a lot about a car by working on it yourself. Safe to say I won't be buying it again. To blame the engineer for the flaws of the final product is not fair.
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Steve Vai
Endurance Guy: Tolerates most of us.
This is every product on earth and it gets worse year after year.
so if you race ebikes....are we at the point yet that there needs to be separate classes?Well... looks like Pivot has decided to join the arms race...
Shuttle AMP'd
Built for riders who don’t dial it back, the AMP’d is a showcase of what the Avinox M2S can unleash when paired with a chassis forged through two decades of suspension design. With 150mm of rear travel paired to a 160mm fork and a gravity-inspired build, it hits hard and charges deep, while...www.pivotcycles.com
1300w boost power? Damn...
I wish Pivot would get away from the 157mm rear hub width. As cool as this bike looks, that's a deal-killer for me.
And this is just one of a whole slew of new Avinox "version 2" e-bikes that were dropped today.
And I solved the 157 problem...I just mostly own pivots now.
Its going to keep getting worse as engineers design things like cars to be assembled by robots....with the final assembly being merely a marriage of many pre-assembled sub assemblies.....So assemble the engine/subframe/suspension components in another location....then it just gets put into the car as 1 part....this is why cars suck to work on. I dont blame the engineers for this stuff....The Elons of the world drive these decisions in an effort to get the stock price up another nickel.
At least NJ got ahead of these 1500W/150nm bikes. They won't be the last to ban e-bikes, guaranteed.
Steve Vai
Endurance Guy: Tolerates most of us.
The new version of the bill that the cycling advocacy groups are pushing to get passed basically gets all bike shop e-bikes banned anyway. Every bike we sell from the Levo to Como to Vado gets lumped into the Surron group, only 1&2 will lose the license, registration, and insurance requirements.
I don't think DJI give a flying FK about us losing trail acess. I have been having a ton of fun on the CX race motor and i really think that where DJI is going will hurt access for E-Mtbs and traditional bikes.
It's rumored that DJI is supported by the chinese government so they aren't counting on profits. They just want to crush bosche.
I have been putting a fair bit of energy into fighting back against the EBIKE legislation and these new bike certaily weaken our case that Pedal-Assist bike should not be lumped in with E-motos. Kinda sucks
It's also worth noting that no modern drivetrain was designed to put up with this amount of power. They should sell
them with a chain checker.
JPark
Well-Known Member
I'd rather them use that technology to make a 100Nm bike lighter and with longer range.Well... looks like Pivot has decided to join the arms race...
Shuttle AMP'd
Built for riders who don’t dial it back, the AMP’d is a showcase of what the Avinox M2S can unleash when paired with a chassis forged through two decades of suspension design. With 150mm of rear travel paired to a 160mm fork and a gravity-inspired build, it hits hard and charges deep, while...
1300w boost power? Damn...
I wish Pivot would get away from the 157mm rear hub width. As cool as this bike looks, that's a deal-killer for me.
And this is just one of a whole slew of new Avinox "version 2" e-bikes that were dropped today.
It's still limited to 20mph so with that power you could be climbing hills at 20 mph with zero effort.
Ian F
Well-Known Member
Definitely. For how I ride, the M2S system doesn't really offer me anything that would significantly improve my riding experience over the bike I already have. Is it more powerful? Yes - but I rarely use the full power of my current bike. Lighter? A little bit, but not significantly so. A bike that has the same power and range as my current bike, but is 10 lbs. (~20%) lighter (WITH heavy AF tires) would be a bike I'd be interested in.
YouTuber B1KER posted a video recently on his experience with the Revel Rerun "mid-power" e-bike. He liked the lighter weight over the ~52 lbs. of his full power Ari bike. Then he swapped out some of the parts as well as installing Schwalbe radial tires and weighed it again - about 48 lbs. Personally, I'm not sure I'd feel much with a <10% weight drop.
Oddly enough, most of the reviews I've watched so far about the M2S bikes have said that while the high power is a fun occasional party-trick, they found it was rarely used and spent most of their rides in Eco or Trail (often adjusted to lower the power output in Trail) modes. Granted, these are generally strong and experienced riders who often don't need to be on an e-bike. Regardless, a common talking point has been a desire for lighter bikes with similar power and range as previously offered. More power isn't really that helpful. Jeff Kendall Weed did comment that as powerful as the M2S is, it still pales in comparison to his actual e-moto with a 15,000 watt motor.
tonyride
Don't piss off the red guy
I don't need, or even want, more power because I can't use it. I want the same power as we've had for the last couple of years (~85nm, 800-1000 watts) but with smaller motors and lighter bikes (sub 40 lbs.). I do like the integration of electronic shifting with the bike battery.